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Budget track car brake fade issues

Harlard said:
Fronts, rears, and a Mustang MC have resulted in the best-feeling power brakes I have used this side of a Porsche 911.

I have noticed, however, that pad knockback is far more apparent with these brakes than it was with stockers and RX7 stuff.
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That brake feel is because you're using a balanced system :)

But that pad knock-back is a real PITA to get around, especially as rotor sizes increase. I experienced it in the rally car as well, the compliance in the 240 spindle/hub is more than people think. I'm used to driving crap-boxes so having the pedal not be consistent doesn't really scare me too much, for others they think there's a brake fluid leak or something.

Good thing Wilwood makes a few different rates of knock-back springs for their calipers. I'm sure they'd work in other calipers as well.
 
culberro said:
That brake feel is because you're using a balanced system :)

But that pad knock-back is a real PITA to get around, especially as rotor sizes increase. I experienced it in the rally car as well, the compliance in the 240 spindle/hub is more than people think. I'm used to driving crap-boxes so having the pedal not be consistent doesn't really scare me too much, for others they think there's a brake fluid leak or something.

Good thing Wilwood makes a few different rates of knock-back springs for their calipers. I'm sure they'd work in other calipers as well.
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There's also this:

https://porterfield-brakes.com/prod...rdware/knock-back-spring/knock-back-spring-6/

BRB, getting some pads and springs and seals.
 
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Pads, cooling, bleed regularly. No need to ditch the stock 240 braking system for trackday games at your power / grip / stint levels.

Are you willing to swap pads at the track, or do you want to track on street pads?

Hawk 9012s are a decent entry-level track pad that won't break the bank, and are available in 240-friendly sizing. They will not fade on you, though they will be happier if you can get some air onto the rotors.

Hawk do some "track day" pads (HP+) that are streetable as well. Cooling is more important if you are really pushing these, but no need to get filthy at the beginning / end of the day.

https://www.zeckhausen.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=27_3262_3263
 
shoestring said:
We would get better than 24 hours out of a set of Hawk 9012s.
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This I don't understand. That's great for you guys, we just never saw that good of pad life. Even at Oregon Raceway Park I'd be lucky to get 6 hours of track time out of a set of HPS pads if I was going full ham in the 242 turbo. Granted, there's a ton of elevation gain per lap there.

Rally racing it's max 5hrs of stage racing (with the Hawk 9012)before they are down to the plates. This is why I did the Wilwood kit. The pads and rotors last sooooooo much longer.
 
blkaplan said:
Drivers / driving style can play a big roll in pad wear.

When Randy Pobst drove our car, we noticed a 50% increase in pad wear.
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That's because he is aggressive and fast. I'm hard on brakes. When I pull in grid after a run people will comment that my brakes smell hot. I just smile and say, "yeah, they are".
 
Harlard said:
I believe you if that's on a constant speed oval :-P
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Dude we had 3 B class wins, a crapload of top 5's overall, best finish was a 2nd at New Jersey Motorsports Park. In fact we finished 3rd the year before that, and 3rd the year before that. We raced with guys in the Northeast, so it's no powder puff event. Swedish Mafia Racing. We were good. :volvo:
 
Well after a lot of thinking I decided to go with the R brakes. I want the extra headroom and confidence that they give and I found a decent deal on a set locally. Now comes the adapting part. I'd like to make adapters myself or have a local shop machine some for me. Does anyone know where I can find dimensions or a CAD file of some adapters?
 
Nickagriffin said:
Well after a lot of thinking I decided to go with the R brakes. I want the extra headroom and confidence that they give and I found a decent deal on a set locally. Now comes the adapting part. I'd like to make adapters myself or have a local shop machine some for me. Does anyone know where I can find dimensions or a CAD file of some adapters?
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STS sells them, why bother recreating the wheel?
 
blkaplan said:
STS sells them, why bother recreating the wheel?
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Rears are out of stock and I think I could do it on the cheap myself. Plus learning new things is fun

edit: Seems people on older TB threads were upset about people asking for dimensions so I'll just see if I can figure them out on my own
 
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Do XC90 discs have the air vents on the outside of the disk? Not ideal if using air ducts to cool the brakes on track.
 
if they're able to stop a xc90 (big heavy tank) i wonder if they needed venting, The bigger discs can handle a lot more engergy.

There is a dutch guy on here that has xc90 brakes on his volvo 740. I forgot his username but will look for it later. Maybe he can tell us how they perform.
 
crogthomas said:
Do XC90 discs have the air vents on the outside of the disk? Not ideal if using air ducts to cool the brakes on track.
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Yes they do, they do pull air from the front though, so if you have open wheels like I do it's hardly needed to do ducted cooling with their physical size. At least that's the theory haven't been able to take them onto the track yet:oops:

The conversion is pretty involved however, and they are relatively heavy. Given what everyone is reporting here, better brake fluid + braided lines + race pads should do the trick
 
SkeTchy-MechAniC said:
if they're able to stop a xc90 (big heavy tank) i wonder if they needed venting, The bigger discs can handle a lot more engergy.
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Race cars don't stop just once (that's called "crashing" and usually doesn't involve the brakes).

No rotor is large enough to absorb the energy from stopping repeatedly. This is why venting matters; you need to get rid of as much heat between corners as you put in stopping for them, otherwise things melt.

You don't need big rotors to stop something once. You need them to absorb and then get rid of the heat before you stop it again. Surface area is how you get rid of heat, volume is how you spread it out.
 
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