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1800 best engine/ trans swap ??

T

Two Yoots

New member
Joined
Jul 7, 2024
New guy here
Waiting for delivery on a 72 1800es manual.
The goal is to keep it manual but get 200-300hp out of either the original motor or different volvo (or other) motor/trans combo.
Fenders and quarters will be flared, tires axle etc... so I am not worried about keeping it original. I dont know too much about these cars other than they are cool.
Looks like heater box may be in the way... I'm ok with removing it and opening the tunnel a little if absolutely neccessary.
I understand the tunnel is tight and would like to be able to still keep the original seats.
I would like to keep it all Volvo so is there a donor car year/make/model that I can buy for my drivetrain that can provide me this power with me installing a cam, upgraded fuel sys, turbo... etc. without breaking the bank and without too much butchering.

Obviously the simpler the better a short narrow 4cyl rather than a longer 5cyl makes sense to me with a turbo.
Wider tires/wheel also being installed... any advice on what would fit? from what car?
Are there any links that can be provided or advice
to make this happen.
 
Getting 2-300 out of the b20 isn’t easy, but it’s not completely impossible. What’s your budget look like? How mechanical are you?

150 is pretty good fun in an old 1800/122 chassis. Beyond that, you can expect too much power for the 50s designed suspension and braking systems.

Starting from the bottom. Bigger brakes, there’s S60R Brembo brake upgrades, or swap to 4x4.5 bolt pattern and go with wilwood. See the FS section for group buys.

Suspension will probably need some work, sways, shocks, springs… and there’s a few approaches.

Over the 150 mark and you’ll want to think about upgraded the rear axle and transmission. T5 transmission swap is the go to. There’s also adapters for the tremec tkx. For the rear, using a 240/700 rear or going to a ford 8.8 are common, but require welding.
 
I agree with cwdodson for the most part, back in the day 200hp was about the max people were squeezing out of a B20 naturally aspirated, and getting there is relatively expensive only to end up with a motor you can't realistically run on the street. I'm pretty sure 300 would be a record for a B20.

That said there have been developments for these engines since the days of the Competition Service and R sport catalog staged parts. The way to get a street driveable car with power seems to be boring and stroking the B20. Tinus Tuning and Swedish Relics are the folks to talk about with those engines and know a good deal about making these cars perform. Hiperfauto and Planetman here on the forums have also built some fun kind of insane B20 cars. A friend of mine has a 2.5L stroker built by Swedish Relics in his Amazon and that thing flies. Although at that level of power you will want to be looking at EFI (megasquirt seemst to be the common go to) or side draft weber carburetors. This is all the easy route for stuff that will "bolt in".

You likely won't have the cut up the tunnel or heater box to fit a T5, just some hammering in a few spots if at all. Cwdodson is the guy to talk to about adapter plates for B18/20 bell housings. With a goal of say 150-300hp or some (your high number and cw's "fun" number) a T5 is probably for the best.

Going with more power than that, well there is the B21/23/230 overhead cam engines. Those require more work and fitting anything like a turbo will be a tight fit in that engine bay. Those engines are really expensive to get NA power from.

To be honest if you do hit 200hp with the original seats, you will be flying all over the place inside that car going around corners. 1800 seats don't really have much in the way of bolstering.

cwdodson88 said:
Over the 150 mark and you’ll want to think about upgraded the rear axle and transmission. T5 transmission swap is the go to. There’s also adapters for the tremec tkx. For the rear, using a 240/700 rear or going to a ford 8.8 are common, but require welding.
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I would disagree with you here. An 1800ES would have a 27 spline Dana 30 rear end with rear discs. The pumpkin is the same as a 140 or 240 1030 axle. We know those will hold a good amount of power without breaking a sweat and can easily be upgraded to an LSD. I would worry if this were an 1800S or Jensen car with the tapered axle drum brakes. This is one thing OP probably doesn't need to worry about. Big front brakes (nordicar sells a kit if wilwood parts aren't to their liking) is a good idea. No need to go all the way to S60R brakes in a 2600lb car. Just do what we all do with these and find a set of 240 or 740 alloy 15 or 16 inch wheels and slap good tires on them.

TL;DR, There are well trodden paths to a fun 150 hp car, but deviating beyond those ends with a lot of work and a likely empty wallet even when doing all the labor yourself. If you are in the US call Cameron at Swedish Relics and if you are in Europe call Tinus Tuning. If you want general advice with these old cars PM Hiperfauto or Planetman here.
 
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There are a few people that have made it past the 200hp mark, but not staying NA. Cameron at Swedish Relics has a sweet little 122 with a lyshom supercharger that’s right around there. Dan Hali had his 142 up over that mark with a Savar J piped holset turboed b20, and my 122 was running 7.5 second 1/8ths on a stock bottom end. Jens Gustafsen was in the 9s on the quarter with his e85 powered b20, putting out around 500 whp. So it can be done, it’s just a matter of what’s the budget, and what’s the ideal driving condition. Do you want something that starts every morning and gets you groceries? Or do you want a strip monster?

My current build sheet puts me at around 10k on powertrain build. Thats including the 8.8 swap, tkx, full fuel and ignition system, water meth, and bw7163 turbo.
 
spock345 said:
And also probably a lot of the machining and fabrication done yourself.
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Yes on free labor fabrication with materials at cost, machining was tallied up at what I put them up for at “market value” to keep me from undercutting myself when I make things for other people. So materials/tooling/and setup fee were used on all machines parts. Outside machining for bore and head work was what I paid for the work.
 
without breaking the bank and without too much butchering.
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giphy.gif

 
OK guys very very interesting.... I see some vision in CW and Spock
First I thought I was going to get bombarded with WHY WOULD YOU CUT UP THAT CAR YOU A HOLE.... then
I thought I would be bombarded with suggestions for bunch of later model Volvo donor cars that I could swap in the engine/trans/rear from ... Isnt the b20 just from the older model cars?
I guess the easiest thing to do from a fabrication perspective would be to keep the B20... maybe bore and stroke it, cam, fab the hot and cold sides for a turbo (could I use the stock intake and throttle with larger injectors and pump? would it be tunable on my end? then wait for the trans to blow up and install a T-5? If the b21/23/230 engine will also require a turbo but its a lot more work to make it fit it seems staying with the b20 may be the way to go.
Going out on a limb here..... what about one of those E-bay AMR superchargers? has anyone ever tried one just for laughs. If it sucks I go turbo.
Going to do all the work myself Fabrication, welding, Blah Blah... dont really have a budget but want to get the type of engine right the first time and building on that platform.
Hey CWdodson ! could I find Cameron and Dan Hali on the interweb? my wife does the grocery shopping my job is burn outs
 
I'm building a B23FT powered 1800ES currently.

If this was not a vision I had when I bought the car for $2k 16+ years ago, combined with the fact I have not grown up a bit since than and am not excited the least bit by restoring the car to stock, I would not be doing it.
 
Two Yoots said:
OK guys very very interesting.... I see some vision in CW and Spock
First I thought I was going to get bombarded with WHY WOULD YOU CUT UP THAT CAR YOU A HOLE.... then
I thought I would be bombarded with suggestions for bunch of later model Volvo donor cars that I could swap in the engine/trans/rear from ... Isnt the b20 just from the older model cars?
I guess the easiest thing to do from a fabrication perspective would be to keep the B20... maybe bore and stroke it, cam, fab the hot and cold sides for a turbo (could I use the stock intake and throttle with larger injectors and pump? would it be tunable on my end? then wait for the trans to blow up and install a T-5? If the b21/23/230 engine will also require a turbo but its a lot more work to make it fit it seems staying with the b20 may be the way to go.
Going out on a limb here..... what about one of those E-bay AMR superchargers? has anyone ever tried one just for laughs. If it sucks I go turbo.
Going to do all the work myself Fabrication, welding, Blah Blah... dont really have a budget but want to get the type of engine right the first time and building on that platform.
Hey CWdodson ! could I find Cameron and Dan Hali on the interweb? my wife does the grocery shopping my job is burn outs
Click to expand...
Cameron’s car is all written up somewhere. Google Swedish Relics. Dan Hali did a pretty good write up on here about 10 years ago. The car has been parted/sold. I have a crap build thread, soon to be revised once I get the last bits worked out.

For a d-jet car, you’ll need to upgrade to a stand alone EMS for fuel/spark tuning. These are traktor motors. Lots of different options for how to approach it, but all require a lot more than swapping like for like.
 
Two Yoots said:
OK guys very very interesting.... I see some vision in CW and Spock
First I thought I was going to get bombarded with WHY WOULD YOU CUT UP THAT CAR YOU A HOLE.... then
I thought I would be bombarded with suggestions for bunch of later model Volvo donor cars that I could swap in the engine/trans/rear from ... Isnt the b20 just from the older model cars?
I guess the easiest thing to do from a fabrication perspective would be to keep the B20... maybe bore and stroke it, cam, fab the hot and cold sides for a turbo (could I use the stock intake and throttle with larger injectors and pump? would it be tunable on my end? then wait for the trans to blow up and install a T-5? If the b21/23/230 engine will also require a turbo but its a lot more work to make it fit it seems staying with the b20 may be the way to go.
Going out on a limb here..... what about one of those E-bay AMR superchargers? has anyone ever tried one just for laughs. If it sucks I go turbo.
Going to do all the work myself Fabrication, welding, Blah Blah... dont really have a budget but want to get the type of engine right the first time and building on that platform.
Hey CWdodson ! could I find Cameron and Dan Hali on the interweb? my wife does the grocery shopping my job is burn outs
Click to expand...
If you want to do a turbo then jump right to a T5, you will likely just pop the M41 currently in the car which is a $1k+ transmission in good shape. Sell that and then buy a T5.

I recall doing the math on the AMR 500 supercharger, they really want a smaller 1-1.5L engine like you'd find in a Kei car for it to work out. A larger Aisin from an AW11 MR2 or Previa may work. Then there are also plenty of Eaton M45, 62, and 90 units floating about.
 
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Thanks guys.. looks like a lot of room on the driver side for an Eaton or other.
BTW there is a cheap solstice GXP for sale Ecotech 2.0 260hp donor something to look into.. not sure if this has ever been done.. I know I'm all over right now but trying to figure it all out. Cant wait to get out the Sawzall to all you simple minded haters
 
Two Yoots said:
Cant wait to get out the Sawzall to all you simple minded haters
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No one gives a fuck what you do until you show some results. Since the dawn on Tb there’s always someone on here saying they’re going to preform magic for no money or skills then end up parting it out

Inb4 “crush it”

For a real inspiration look up p1800 cyan
 
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