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Can we officially address the Myths on the TB forum (w primary sources)

I'm not sure it is a myth but there seems to be common refrains that modifications such as e fan swaps should be done on cars that have run just fine for decades stock.
 
One myth we have in this thread, that there are any primary sources that can disprove common TB myths. Unless it is publication from Volvo or a rare thread like "what is interference" it is going to be anecdotal.
 
AnthonyHardy2 said:
I think the difference there is the efan is very rarely running when you're using peak HP on a street car but the mech fan is always pulling some amount of power. You're probably right that it isn't using as much HP as people think it does though since they have clutches.


Anecdotally the squirter engines supposedly generally have less bore wear but that doesn't mean anything in this thread (or in general really) and I doubt anyone's ever going to actually try to measure enough B230s bores to get a real comparison.
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That's exactly right. The e-fan on my 940 never runs when the car is on the highway at speed, which for me, is 90% of my driving. Even in stop and go traffic it rarely runs, unless, it is over 90 degrees out, or, I'm running the AC.

As far as squirter engines are concerned, they are quiet with 300K+ miles on them. Something I can't prove without a dyno and being hooked up to data logging, they always seem to produce more power as far as high mileage engines are concerned. My GUESS is that the knock sensor picks up the piston slap in the non-squirter engines and the ECU processes that as pre-ignition and pulls some timing.
 
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2manyturbos said:
That's exactly right. The e-fan on my 940 never runs when the car is on the highway at speed, which for me, is 90% of my driving. Even in stop and go traffic it rarely run, unless, it is over 90 degrees out, or, I'm running the AC.
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I feel like everything else in the engine bay gets cooked on E fan cars though. The engine bay is scorching after most drives on my brothers 940, but my 740 only ever gets toasty. I have the 92c thermostat too. Maybe it's cope but I feel like that contributes to the longevity of the plastics and rubbers in the engine bay
 
I think the amount of anecdotal evidence being presented here may be a primary source supporting the lack of primary sources on TB.

I am assuming that by primary sources OP meant some level of rigor in gathering evidence.
 
2manyturbos said:
As far as squirter engines are concerned, they are quiet with 300K+ miles on them. Something I can't prove without a dyno and being hooked up to data logging, they always seem to produce more power as far as high mileage engines are concerned. My GUESS is that the knock sensor picks up the piston slap in the non-squirter engines and the ECU processes that as pre-ignition and pulls some timing.
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I still think it makes sense to source a squirter block if you can when building a redblock both because the theory makes sense and because it makes sense to start with the best engine you can. Also no one has presented a theory for why squirters would be worse but it's likely that none of us will have the means or motivation to prove that it definitively makes a difference one way or another.

Even if you did dyno it and you measured every single dimension on both engines and found that everything was more worn on the squirter engine it'd be impossible to prove that it wasn't a result of them being used and cared for differently over their 30-40 year lifespans. Frequent short trips vs long freeway commutes, different maintenance intervals, how heavy the drivers feet were, etc could all potentially make more of a difference than squirters at this point.
 
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AnthonyHardy2 said:
I still think it makes sense to source a squirter block if you can when building a redblock both because the theory makes sense and because it makes sense to start with the best engine you can and no one has presented a theory for why squirters would be worse but it's likely that none of us will have the means or motivation to prove that it definitively makes a difference one way or another.

Even if you did dyno it and you measured every single dimension on both engines and found that everything was more worn on the squirter engine it'd be impossible to prove that it wasn't a result of them being used and cared for differently over their 30-40 year lifespans. Frequent short trips vs long freeway commutes, different maintenance intervals, how heavy the drivers feet were, etc could all potentially make more of a difference than squirters at this point.
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So you are saying we shouldn't B20 swap everything?
 
2manyturbos said:
That's exactly right. The e-fan on my 940 never runs when the car is on the highway at speed, which for me, is 90% of my driving. Even in stop and go traffic it rarely runs, unless, it is over 90 degrees out, or, I'm running the AC.

As far as squirter engines are concerned, they are quiet with 300K+ miles on them. Something I can't prove without a dyno and being hooked up to data logging, they always seem to produce more power as far as high mileage engines are concerned. My GUESS is that the knock sensor picks up the piston slap in the non-squirter engines and the ECU processes that as pre-ignition and pulls some timing.
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At highway speeds the clutch fan - assuming the clutch is working like it should - is just free wheeling.
 
Led said:
Piston squirters should also help cool the pistons, no?
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But like how much exactly? Enough to matter on a 200k+ mile stock engine that someone is putting a “big” 15g turbo on to run 12 pounds on otherwise stock lh2.4? Doubtful.
 
Marvelous3 said:
But like how much exactly? Enough to matter on a 200k+ mile stock engine that someone is putting a “big” 15g turbo on to run 12 pounds on otherwise stock lh2.4? Doubtful.
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No one is adding squirters to a 200k mile engine without a rebuild


I mean I’m sure someone did but just rebuild it at that point
 
I haven't driven a redblock car with squirters that had piston slap. My 1990 engine slaps so hard it'll even do it when hot. The bores are worn halfway up the stroke from the skirt smacking into it at TDC, I can't believe it still has great compression. I have a squirter motor going in soon just because I hate the racket that much.
 
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