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Looking for an old Volvo...need advice

M

mikec4193

New member
Joined
Apr 9, 2018
Location
Malta NY (upstate NY)
Hi Turbobrick people

I have been contemplating about another project to fiddle with in the shop...maybe an old PV or maybe an Amazon...I grew up with German cars...I have not had anything of that persuasion since before Covid started in my garage...it has been all American vintage tin...

So for a first time vintage Volvo owner...which model would be a better starter Volvo???

I don't restore cars...I fix what needs to get fixed and I get them to run and drive in a safe manor and enjoy them as older running vehicles...

Any insight would be great.

Thanks in advance.
 
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mikec4193 said:
Hi Turbobrick people

I have been contemplating about another project to fiddle with in the shop...maybe an old PV or maybe an Amazon...I grew up with German cars...I have not had anything of that persuasion since before Covid started in my garage...it has been all American vintage tin...

So for a first time vintage Volvo owner...which model would be a better starter Volvo???

I don't restore cars...I fix what needs to get fixed and I get them to run and drive in a safe manor and enjoy them as older running vehicles...

Any insight would be great.

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
Almost every single Amazon and PV will need floors. Early pvs come with b16s and there isn’t room for a b18/20 without much modification from what I remember

The consensus is pv>amazon but I only have experience with amazons

I was a 240 guy until I got my first Amazon.

Don’t get automatics they are horrible and have a different transmission tunnel


You can get just about everything from Vp-auto parts.com for these cars

Pre 68 will have asbestos in the sound deadening
 
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dl242gt said:
Plus if you like wagons. There are Amazon wagons. They also came as both 2dr and 4dr sedans. So good choices to refurbish and enjoy.
Click to expand...
to add to this
Production numbers
coupes > sedans > wagons (wagons being pretty rare these days)

Be aware that essentially from the B pillar back everything body wise is different on a wagon and often not reproduced anymore

Nothing suspension wise changed in the wagons over the years

Starting in 1967 the sedans/coupes got a better rear suspension
 
Ok...I see...so maybe start with late model Amazon and fiddle with it...they remind me of the 1968 Mercedes Benz my mother drove for so many years back in the 1970s...

Those PV's tho...they really make me think 1940 Ford...love those old Fords a lot...

I will commence my search...see how what pops up...and what I can afford too...

I love the old crusty stuff the best...

MikeC
 
IMO, it depends on what you plan on using it for.
Rust, rust, rust in New England.
I really enjoyed my 1970 145S, '72 145S but especially the '72 144E. They were all daily drivers 1994-2015.
I've got my dad's '68 122S wagon which never was a favorite but is cool to have.
My '60 PV544 is fun, but just don't have the time for it and would never consider it as a daily driver.

Bottom line...me(?), I'd get back in a '67-'72 140 series if I was still interested.
 
I've either owned or extensively driven:
- PV544
- 122 (sedan and wagon)
- 1800E (two of them)
- 145S and 145E
- 245 (variety of HP's from 150 to 500-ish)

And you know what? The PV is somehow just more fun to drive. Not sure why. I've owned mine for almost 30 years now.

It is lighter by a few hundred pounds than the next lightest old Volvo 122 coupe. SO whatever HP you put in it feels more fun than the same motor in any other old Volvo. The B16 engined PV's are extremely easy to swap to B18/20 motors. I haven't done it, but it just takes moving a clutch pivot point and a crossover tube for the radiator.

Each successive model from Volvo seems to be a little less special, but a little more refined. Progress and all. But they're all pretty nice vintage cars to own. Because they're all nice combinations of mostly English style mechanical bits and German (Bosch) electrical systems. SO they do need more attention than a modern car, by far, but they're more reliable and durable than your average 50's and 60's car, much less the 50's and 60's imports.

As already mentioned, unless already restored, most old Volvo's will need at least floorboards. They tended to use rubber floor mats which held moisture under them soaked into some fiber sound deadening material. Very good at encouraging rust.

PV's are still well supported parts wise. They made a lot, a lot of them (relatively speaking) are still in use. Volvo wasn't really a big enough company to have lots of totally different drivetrain parts, so pretty much everything is shared with a similar year 122 and/or 1800.

There is a wagon version of the PV, the Duett. But unlike the other wagons Volvo made since then which are very similar to the sedans and coupe, just with a wagon tail grafted on, The Duett was a commercial vehicle that was sometimes sold as a cab-chassis, and as such it has a body on frame construction. And instead of a (weird) 4 link coil spring rear suspension, the Duett has a leaf spring setup. Tall 2 door wagon with barn doors in the back, These are very rare in the US. And probably fairly rare in Sweden now as well, used hard as a work vehicle and then disposed when worn out.

Here's my hoopty PV with a roughly 165 HP 2.1L B20 going around Tail of the Dragon a couple of years ago.
nyfqOrN.jpg
 
mikec4193 said:
So for a first time vintage Volvo owner...which model would be a better starter Volvo???

I don't restore cars...I fix what needs to get fixed and I get them to run and drive in a safe manor and enjoy them as older running vehicles...
Click to expand...

My 2¢ on the question.

For context, of the 1974 and older pushrod-powered Volvos, I have owned:
1x 544S
5x 122/123GT
6x P1800/S/E/ES
2x 142S/E

Of that list of cars, the 544 (1963) was too primitive of a platform for my taste and preference, mainly due to drum brakes in all 4 corners. I drive my various 1975 and older Volvos on 2-3 days vintage car rallys going on back roads & mountains of Northern California: Coastal Range, Gold County, & Sierra Nevadas. These routes go on fair amount of winding roads, hairpin turns, switchbacks, etc. so brakes are a critial system for these events. As JohnMc mentioned, the 444/544 are a lighter platform which with a moderately tuned B18 or B20 will be quick(er). One other consideration of the 444 and pre-1962 544 and 122s is they are 6V cars from the factory.

The 122 Amazon is a great overall platform and joining the chorus of previous posts, would be type I would recommend as an introduction to vintage Volvos. There were a lot of these made and good number of survivors to be found. As Jack perviuosly stated, VP is the premier parts place. In recent years, FCP and IPD's parts inventory for the pushrod cars have been greatly reduced in scope which is unfortunate. Currently I am in the middle of restoring a 1967 122S which was last registered in 1984. It looks like it was stored indoors for that time as it has some rust but nothing drastic other than the nose piece.
(https://turbobricks.com/index.php?t...an-amazon-after-a-40-year-hibernation.374378/)

The 140s while being a little more refined, have the same basic running gear as the 122/1800, steering and suspension. Being a heavier and larger car, they did not seem as spritely as the Amazons. While my 1973 142E had a 130HP B20E and fuel injection, it still felt more like driving a truck compared to my 1967 123GT. Both cars have IPD front swaybar, B6 HD Bilsteins, 195 15" Wheels and M41 manual transmission.


The middle three are mine (1967 123GT, 1967 122S, 1965 1800S) the other are owned by a friend of mine (1967 122 wagon, 1972 1800ES).
54402341653_aa9918b9c2_b.jpg


21505710911_c1f02d35d9_b.jpg


21333024498_b80d8f51cc_b.jpg


16676467724_6913a36399_b.jpg
 
polaris said:
Of that list of cars, the 544 (1963) was too primitive of a platform for my taste and preference, mainly due to drum brakes in all 4 corners.
Click to expand...
Good point. I think early enough 122's also have drums in the front as well. I did find them somewhat easy to overheat and fade away to nothingness with a bit of spirited driving. 122 front discs are a close to bolt on upgrade, they both used the same drum brakes, and the discs on the 122 were designed to fit in the same way. I just had to redrill the caliper bracket *I think some place sells these brackets for 544's now), move the shock *mounts bolt onto the suspension and reverse easily) and do a little creative work with the brake lines.

5wsPfOn.jpeg


Driven hard enough, the unvented 122 discs can get a bit warm and start to make smells, but I haven't really noticed them fading much.

That pic also shows the more primitive front suspension on the PV, with double A-arms holding a carrier with a kingpin. I's certainly an older style design, but I'm not sure it's worse. At the expense of having 6 grease points per side, it's almost all nice precise no-slop metal bushings.
 
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Jack said:
For me Amazons are American styling with European size and more modern suspension compared to contemporary American cars
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More modern even compared to what the British were putting in their sports cars (not counting the Jags).
JohnMc said:
Driven hard enough, the unvented 122 discs can get a bit warm and start to make smells, but I haven't really noticed them fading much.
Click to expand...
A friend of mine has toasted the brakes in his 122 before. Granted that was on one of the previously mentioned rallies and his engine is a bored and stroked 2.5L monster.
 
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