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Rebuilt injection pump still not starting car

Jroll107

Jroll107

New member
Joined
May 21, 2024
Location
Savannah ga
So my buddy has a 1984 240 with the d24 non turbo (for the record it’s also a manual if that helps any but probably not) and we are struggling to get it started. We have timed it properly, bled the fuel lines, has good glow plugs and it has good compression. We are getting it to fire but it’s not catching if that makes sense. If anyone has any advice I would appreciate it
 
Beware diesel fuel pressure is high enough to inject into you causing poisoning. The only way to stop it is amputation.First- is the pump pulling the fuel from the tank? Is there fuel going into the injectors? What happens if either is sparingly sprayed into the intake?
 
When you say you timed it properly - what numerical value on the dial indicator is it set to?

And did you disengage the cold start advance cable when setting the static timing using the dial indicator?

Why was the injection pump worked on?

Did it run for you previously before the IP was removed and rebuilt? Or are you resurrecting something that hasn't run in years?

More help will be with the diesel group on D24T.com - most members here are well versed in the 4 banger gas engines but have never even seen a diesel in person let alone touched one with a wrench.
 
FYI - NEVER NEVER NEVER spray any ether into this engine. You will shatter rings and crack pistons right away. This works in big industrial diesels if used with extraordinary caution but if you use it on this engine you may as well just throw the whole thing away. This is a small displacement prechamber diesel with glow plugs, not a container ship engine. No diesel this size can withstand ether explosions, this is not unique to D24 or its relatives.

NEVER use it even just for "diagnostic" purposes. Even if you did what the other comment above told you to....... What would that actually tell you in terms of useful info? It's not running on its own fuel and you already know that.

Reaching for the ether at a moment of frustration with a diesel that is mistimed and won't start is very tempting. Don't do it or you'll waste all the work you've already done and money you've spent. You'll regret that. Find the problem and be patient until you do. 👍
 
v8volvo said:
When you say you timed it properly - what numerical value on the dial indicator is it set to?

And did you disengage the cold start advance cable when setting the static timing using the dial indicator?

Why was the injection pump worked on?

Did it run for you previously before the IP was removed and rebuilt? Or are you resurrecting something that hasn't run in years?

More help will be with the diesel group on D24T.com - most members here are well versed in the 4 banger gas engines but have never even seen a diesel in person let alone touched one with a wrench.
Click to expand...
He got the car for $650 and it’s been sitting for 6 years. When we first looked at it no fuel was coming out of the fuel lines so he sent the injection pump off to a diesel performance shop to get rebuilt
 
2 old for this said:
Beware diesel fuel pressure is high enough to inject into you causing poisoning. The only way to stop it is amputation.First- is the pump pulling the fuel from the tank? Is there fuel going into the injectors? What happens if either is sparingly sprayed into the intake?
Click to expand...
It is pulling from the tank, it’s going into the injectors, and when either is sprayed into it it will slow the starter down
 
Jroll107 said:
when either is sprayed into it it will slow the starter down
Click to expand...

Well, cross your fingers you didn't already blow it up. "slowing down the starter" is not a sign that the engine likes what you're feeding it. But you can hope for a chance that it survives.

OK, you are at a fork in the road with this car where you can either decide to succeed or not. Success is EASY with a diesel, including a D24, because they are incredibly simple engines. But you have to commit to understanding how it works and setting up the engine the right way with the right procedures. There is no "other way" or shortcut.

If you want to get it going without fighting with it or destroying it in the process, here are your first two steps.

1) Throw the can of ether away.

2) Explain the process you used for setting injection pump and camshaft timing, including what timing tool set you used and the final dial indicator reading you set it to (measured in mm).

Note: if those questions don't make sense, don't worry. Just describe what you have done up to this point so that we can understand what steps have or haven't been taken and advise you on how to proceed from here to get it running smooth. If you did it with a paint pen and trying to line up punch marks, that's OK. We can help you reset it correctly.
 
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v8volvo said:
Well, cross your fingers you didn't already blow it up. "slowing down the starter" is not a sign that the engine likes what you're feeding it. But you can hope for a chance that it survives.

OK, you are at a fork in the road with this car where you can either decide to succeed or not. Success is EASY with a diesel, including a D24, because they are incredibly simple engines. But you have to commit to understanding how it works and setting up the engine the right way with the right procedures. There is no "other way" or shortcut.

If you want to get it going without fighting with it or destroying it in the process, here are your first two steps.

1) Throw the can of ether away.

2) Explain the process you used for setting injection pump and camshaft timing, including what timing tool set you used and the final dial indicator reading you set it to (measured in mm).

Note: if those questions don't make sense, don't worry. Just describe what you have done up to this point so that we can understand what steps have or haven't been taken and advise you on how to proceed from here to get it running smooth. If you did it with a paint pen and trying to line up punch marks, that's OK. We can help you reset it correctly.
Click to expand...
Honestly we don’t have any type of tool for injection pump timing we have just been going off the marks that are on the flywheel and pulley. We were actually able to finally get it running but it sounded like it was off by a hair so we adjusted it a little bit and lost it. So all we really done was taking the pump off, putting it back on, and making sure the marks line up
 
Jroll107 said:
Honestly we don’t have any type of tool for injection pump timing we have just been going off the marks that are on the flywheel and pulley. We were actually able to finally get it running but it sounded like it was off by a hair so we adjusted it a little bit and lost it. So all we really done was taking the pump off, putting it back on, and making sure the marks line up
Click to expand...
There's a lot more to it than that. There's a tool you insert into the front of the pump with a gauge and you have to do this wacky voodoo dance to get readings that are in the appropriate range - and if they're bad you need to retension the pump and start over. I was doing this in the freezing cold a couple years ago, not really any fun.
 
OK. The good news is you are pretty close if you were getting it to try to start or if it ran at all.

The reason the engine won't run is because it is not timed correctly. The best play now is to pause your efforts on the car until you are equipped to retime it using the right procedure and equipment.

This is one of those jobs that you simply cannot do at all without using the required tools. It's EASY if you get the stuff and go through the required process, but there is no other way.

Kind of like setting ignition timing on an older gasoline engine with a distributor. Have you done that in the past? If so, this will sound similar. It's a job that is easy to do if you have the necessary tool (a timing light). But if you don't have that tool, then you have no way to get it done and you are just working blind.

The pump timing tools are easy to find and extremely cheap. Here is a good set on ebay for 35 bucks with free shipping. This has everything you need including the dial indicator itself.
www.ebay.com

Diesel Fuel Injection Pump Timing Indicator Tool Set for Bosch EP/VE Rotary Dens | eBay

Timing Indicator Set for the Bosch Diesel Injection Pump. This tool set makes the job of precisely setting of the Bosch diesel fuel injection pump easy. For use on Bosch diesel injection systems especially for VW and Audi engines.
www.ebay.com

There are also several folks on the diesel listserve and forum and Facebook groups who are happy to loan these tools out at no cost. Don't let the lack of the tools be the obstacle to getting it done.

The comment above about a "wacky voodoo dance" is wrong, and I'm not sure why that poster said it, since I know for a fact he succeeded with this process in the past so he should be able to attest that it's not that hard (no job is fun with frozen fingers, you can't blame that on the car :p ). It's a simple procedure that is used on every diesel engine with the Bosch VE pump, all around the world for the last 60 years. Every tractor, generator, old Cummins Dodge pickup truck, every Volkswagen and Audi and Peugeot and Volvo. Super straightforward and an everyday process in any diesel shop. Again like setting ignition timing on a gas burner..... nothing to it, once you grasp what you are trying to do and how to do it.

You just need to have the tools and the instructions, and then take it step by step without cutting corners. Then like magic, the engine will fire right up cleanly and run perfectly. (Assuming it doesn't have internal damage from the ether. Just hope for the best on that though. At this point you have nothing to lose by timing it and seeing what happens.)

Ready to help with every step here anytime you need it. With the time and $ you've put in already rebuilding and replacing that pump, trust me that this is going to be the easy part, once you have the right equipment.
 
^^ Yes. If they know old (pre-TDI) VW diesels they should be able to do it on this engine. Same timing tools and timing process.
 
What timing setting did you use?

If you fudged it or timed it by ear, then don't open your beers yet, you are not done in any way.

The reason it wouldn't run before was the timing was too retarded.

Now it could be too advanced. If so, it will run nice when cold but will bend rods or lift the head the first time you climb a hill with the engine warm. Kind of like ignition timing too advanced on a gasser. It's OK for idling around but you'll tear shit up if you run it down the road that way.

If you don't have your timing reading then you have absolutely no idea where you are at and whether you are risking the motor. There's a reason they give you a spec. Don't say we didn't warn you. If you come back next week and tell us now it looks like it lost compression or blew the head, this will be why.

Also, how old is the front timing belt?

Glad you got it going by luck, but that only gets you so far. Just don't want you to go from happy to sad if you blow it up your first time you take it for a drive. Seen that kind of sabotage a thousand times. Running is not the same as right.
 
We g
v8volvo said:
What timing setting did you use?

If you fudged it or timed it by ear, then don't open your beers yet, you are not done in any way.

The reason it wouldn't run before was the timing was too retarded.

Now it could be too advanced. If so, it will run nice when cold but will bend rods or lift the head the first time you climb a hill with the engine warm. Kind of like ignition timing too advanced on a gasser. It's OK for idling around but you'll tear shit up if you run it down the road that way.

If you don't have your timing reading then you have absolutely no idea where you are at and whether you are risking the motor. There's a reason they give you a spec. Don't say we didn't warn you. If you come back next week and tell us now it looks like it lost compression or blew the head, this will be why.

Also, how old is the front timing belt?

Glad you got it going by luck, but that only gets you so far. Just don't want you to go from happy to sad if you blow it up your first time you take it for a drive. Seen that kind of sabotage a thousand times. Running is not the same as right.
Click to expand...
One of those little dial things that you sent us. And we’ve only drove it around the parking lot for now till we fix the lights. The timing belt looks old so we’re going to probably replace that here soon.
 
v8volvo said:
So what are your plans for the car?
Click to expand...
But it’s my buddies car and he lives in Wisconsin. He told me that it is going to be his daily until he drives it back home to most likely sell to his brother who collects old Volvos. He likes the car but he feels like his brother would appreciate it more since he is a diesel truck guy
 
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