Tailpipe always smoking...

[linuxman51]

does the cooling system pressurize very quickly after startup?
#4 looks a bit leaner than the rest.
is it possible oil leaked down the plug hole from #3 and gooped it up that way? the washer and threads appear to be dirty as well not just the tip. (TWSS)

 

[linuxman51]

Maybe a cracked head around a valve guide, or a cracked valve guide itself, that worsened with the stem steal replacement? I don't know enough about the 16V heads and if cracks are common. The 16V heads are certainly known for bending valves when the timing belt fails. Do you know the history of your head? Has the engine ever not smoked?

maybe, but that'd be a lot of oil in 20 miles on what look like fairly new plugs. cracked might leak more but still, it was mostly fine for a few minutes then rapidly went south, rapidly I'd almost think something else happened. odd that its just #3 though, that eliminates most anything not cylinder head related

With the plug being that fouled out I personally have a hard time thinking that it is a valve guide issue unless the guide itself is just about gone. I would personally throw a new plug in that hole and swap injectors around 3->4 and go for another drive. See if the concern jumps, hell if you wanted to you could even swap the coil and wire onto a different cylinder as well. Unless there is so much oil in that cylinder its fudging your compression results you may be overfueling that hole and washing the bore down a little bit.

agreed, I went down the mental rabbit hole as well (remembering old forum posts about oval guide bores and leaky guides) but it would be highly unlikely that a single guide on a single cylinder or even multiple guides-but that'd be even more strange-would leak that much oil

I think a possible loose plug coupled with an oil leak in the halves (or at the valve cover gasket end) down into the plug hole would explain it better.. even though the plug body itself looks fairly clean.

 

[cosbySweater]

What Kenny said. 6.4 powerstrokes didn’t even have valves guides in them, they would just machine the head casting. Those guides were always so destroyed and they still would not suck much oil through the guides. It’s all splash lubrication up there anyway

 

[crogthomas]

Has the head been ported?

I'm not familiar with the layout of the Volvo 16v head, but I have seen a SR20 head where the grinder had broken into a oil gallery creating a very tiny pinhole.

 

[bobxyz]

Does anyone know - can you see the back of the valves on a 16V if you use a borescope with a right angle mirror? Maybe look at the valves, let it sit overnight, and look at them again to see if there's any oil accumulation?

The main pressurized oil galley to the head is above the oil filter between #1 and #2, and the drains are all gravity (un-pressurized), so I can't see how a head gasket leak could cause oil in #3.

 

[turbojose]

hey guys.. thank you all for the responses.. I'm getting after it again tonight with some responses posted bellow.

 

[turbojose]

does the cooling system pressurize very quickly after startup?
#4 looks a bit leaner than the rest.
is it possible oil leaked down the plug hole from #3 and gooped it up that way? the washer and threads appear to be dirty as well not just the tip. (TWSS)

the cooling system isn't affected from what I can tell. removing the cap after startup shows no signs of pressure, and no fuel odor. I'm not sure why #4 looks a bit leaner than the rest, maybe we can look at this after the oil issue, unless it's a sign of something more to look at?

I thought about the oil leaking between the two halves, but i was careful to wait and install new o-rings to seal up the spark plug holes good, I know that doesn't explain the oil on the crush washer of the #3 plug, but maybe oil creped up instead of down. either way, i will inspect the spark plug holes for signs of leaking and post a pic.
Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr

I'm almost thinking its time to pull the head and just see what i got? do you agree?

 

[turbojose]

Does anyone know - can you see the back of the valves on a 16V if you use a borescope with a right angle mirror? Maybe look at the valves, let it sit overnight, and look at them again to see if there's any oil accumulation?

The main pressurized oil galley to the head is above the oil filter between #1 and #2, and the drains are all gravity (un-pressurized), so I can't see how a head gasket leak could cause oil in #3.

this seems like a good idea... but at that point i have to remove the exhaust, and i might as well just remove the head to check deeper

 

[turbojose]

Has the head been ported?

I'm not familiar with the layout of the Volvo 16v head, but I have seen a SR20 head where the grinder had broken into a oil gallery creating a very tiny pinhole.

great input... the head is just a stock head. no porting. it was only resurfaced and reseated for valves. they did check at that time for cracks, but i have abused it a bit since then.

 

[turbojose]

Man catching up on this, does the oil smell really fuel diluted?

drained a little of the oil, and it does smell fuel dilluted for sure! i do boost it pretty heavy though at 20-25 psi. i would expect some fuel smell. probably time for an oil change. what are your thoughts on the fuel smell?

 

[bobxyz]

this seems like a good idea... but at that point i have to remove the exhaust, and i might as well just remove the head to check deeper

I was thinking of using the spark plug hole, but don’t know if the angles are too tight to see anything. I guess you could leave it overnight, turn it over by hand slowly so that all the valves cycle, and then look for oil on the walls and on top of the piston.

 

[OVERDRIVE]

A lot to read here and I did skim it all but might have missed something.

Did this head come from an engine that bent valves? Oftentimes the guides will be damaged when that happens. My guess is that you have some damages guides or the guides were replaced and have too much clearance.

 

[linuxman51]

the metal they use for guides is prone to cracking, and I have seen a few cracked over the years. my question on this still would be how does the oil get into the chamber that quickly whilst running? I can see it leaking in with the engine off but the exhaust port is generally under some amount of pressure even at idle, coupled with the direction of airflow I would think running would allow the thing to leave a sooty plug but not a wet one. this looks more like it came from the other side. I'm gonna go poke around at one of my disassembled heads and cogitate on this a bit.. perhaps cracked intake guides could be sucking it in off boost and that's doing it? (that's a lot of oil tho). that'd be easier to check than pulling the exhaust as well, and certainly easier than pulling the head (though... that may be what ends up happening :-/ )

 

[turbojose]

I was thinking of using the spark plug hole, but don’t know if the angles are too tight to see anything. I guess you could leave it overnight, turn it over by hand slowly so that all the valves cycle, and then look for oil on the walls and on top of the piston.

I think Kenny mentioned its a clear view from the intake side. I'm gonna take off the intake and look down and post pics of what i find.

 

[turbojose]

A lot to read here and I did skim it all but might have missed something.

Did this head come from an engine that bent valves? Oftentimes the guides will be damaged when that happens. My guess is that you have some damages guides or the guides were replaced and have too much clearance.

good thought... I pullled this head from a car that had the timing chain still intact. the rebuild was just for good measure as i was already building the bottom end. just a thought though i know i'm probably wrong, but wouldn't good valve stem seals seal up any leak do to back valve guides? I genuienly don't know.

 

[turbojose]

Saga still continues... so i pulled the intake tonight to take a look at the back of the intake valves... not sure i got the definitive answer to my issues. i noticed that the intake has some leaking around the intake gasket. this may be related, or may just be another issue all together not sure. Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr

my hope was that after looking at the back of the valves, i would see an obvious issue and some pooling of oil on cylinder number 3 but as my luck would have it, the #3 intake valves where fully open so any pooling would have disapeared into the cylinder overnight. &#!%%!@... I snapped some pictues, and while cylinder #3 does look a little more oil laden than the rest, I'm not sure what to make of it. the first pic is of cylinder #1 for reference... then #3 hoping you guys can take a look and something will jump out at you. I'm at a loss. thinking about just installing the intake again, and doing some coil and injector swapping to see if the issues move cylinders.

#1 cylinder for reference.
Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr


and here is what i have of #3 with some closeups with a bore scope.
Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr

Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr

Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr

My biggest issue i think is that both intake valves on cylinder #3 look a little oil laden... I would have only expected one if it was a cracked valve guide. Just simple logic I guess... but i'm at a loss.

If we think its head related though, and the block is good, maybe its time for a head swap? anyone got a good ported head with yoshifab cams installed and ready to go sitting on the shelf?

 

[OVERDRIVE]

good thought... I pullled this head from a car that had the timing chain still intact. the rebuild was just for good measure as i was already building the bottom end. just a thought though i know i'm probably wrong, but wouldn't good valve stem seals seal up any leak do to back valve guides? I genuienly don't know.

In my experience, if the engine is burning oil through damaged or worn valve guides, replacing the seals won't help.

 

[cosbySweater]

Check the injectors you should be able to run a test with ms

 

[turbojose]

Check the injectors you should be able to run a test with ms

while i was taking pictures of the intake valves, i had the injector rail off, but still assembled. I tested the injectors for leaking by turning the ignition on and watching fuel pressure build. there was no dripping or spraying from any injectors. I didn't actually trigger any of them under pressure though, so i don't know what the spray is like on each.

 

[turbojose]

quick weekend update. I did have the intake off to take pictures of the intake valves. The #3 had noticeable oil on the back of the valves. pictures above. after testing injectors, and doing some basic cleanup since the intake was off, I had been dreading installing a soft third motor mount, and a new billet PCV box from STS. but since the intake was out of the way... I dug in and got it done.

So for the Update: I re-assebled, and just put a new plug in #3 and went for a simple neighborhood drive. only about 5 miles. there was still noticable smoke after every stop sign, and it feels like its getting worse if I'm being honest. came home and pulled the plugs, and the brand new #3 plug looks terrible again. THIS WAS A BRAND NEW PLUG. it only has 5 miles of driving on it.
Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr
Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr
Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr


While the other plugs all look pretty good.

Untitled by turbojose, on Flickr


I think it's time to do some coil swapping, and possibly some injector swapping.

this is what I'm going to do before my next test drive.

advice from Linuxman51:

moving #4 to #1 and #2 to #3, and put current #3 in #4 and current #1 in #2

and what we're looking for is if #4 suddenly gets very rich (indicating an issue with that injector)

#1 shows a leaner burn which indicates a possible issue with the former #4 injector
#3 cleans up, and
#2 looks about the same as it does now


will report back soon.